Since some people have shown some strong opinions on this topic...I thought I would start one here.

I dont have a lot of experience with dogs...Baby and Isabella are the only dogs I've owned as an adult.

I dont stereotype dogs...I feel like theyre a lot like rabbits...if you breed agressive rabbits you get aggresive baby rabbits. I've seen it happen and I wont breed anything that bites.

I believe that the way a dog is raised can have something to do with the way they behave but I believe that more times than not...it's in the genetics.


I dont believe that certain breeds are more aggressive...just that Emily was right when she said that 80% is genetics. Two aggresive dogs will make aggresive babies.

That's just MPO.

:)

LOL, this is one of my "pet" issues like homosexuality (and abortion, but I hope we don't have to go there, LOL). I don't know if I'll have time to get all my thoughts out here, it's almost bedtime.

I think the "it's the owner not the dog" thing is pants. I have known multiple dogs who have been raised in loving, family homes, and they have turned and attacked their owners unprovoked. One is my online mom friend who's family dog attacked their daughters face as she was reading herself a book. She's had to have many surgeries since then. :( I'll see if I can find her website, it's really sad and scary.

If one of my dogs (I have a Pomeranian and an old toothless Daschund) ever nipped my kids unprovoked, it would be GONE. I have NO tolerance for that. My kids come before animals *always*.

I would never own a Pitbull. I know lots of people say "Oh, they're so sweet" and they like to bring up the whole "it's the owners that make them mean" thing. But I say "No thanks!". Yes, Pitbulls were bred to be animal aggressive, but unfortunately, indiscriminate breeding has left them a mixed bag of aggression. You never know what you're going to get! Pitbulls are a huge problem in CA. HUGE. Too many people overbreeding them. They're everywhere. There's tons dying in shelters and it's really sad. I fully support regulating them. People should not be breeding them like this. According to the CDC, Pitbulls are the #1 breed in people maulings (deaths). One recent one comes to mind of a boy who was going door to door selling things, and a man answers the door and his 3 pits mauled the boy to death. :( There are other breeds that I would also never own, chows, rotts, akitas, etc. But they're not being horribly overbred like pits are here. It's not worth it to me to take a risk owning these dogs. It's just not worth it. And I know that lots of people will say "Oh, but you have a Pom and a daschund! They can bite too!!". Yes, my dogs are fully capable of biting. But they are tiny. My Pom is 6 lbs and my Dach is 4 lbs, the only thing they could kill would be a baby. And there has been an incident of one Pom mauling a baby. One. A Pom could not maul a child or adult. You would get a torn up ankle maybe, but I could totally kill either of my dogs if they attacked me or my children. I will never own a dog over 15 lbs because of the risk. They're animals and I can't trust them 100%.

I'll have to write more later because my computer keeps freezing. Ugg.

But what about Pit Bulls that are responsibly bred? There are breeders that are careful about breeding for good temperment. Not all Pits are aggressive, and thousands of Pit Bull owners around the world would back that up.

As far as fighting/attack dogs are concerned: Pit Bulls are just the dog of choice. In places where Pit Bulls have been banned, other dogs are becoming a problem. Presa Canarios, for instance - the dogs that killed that young woman in California a few years back. Blaming the dog does not address the heart of the problem.

http://sorryagain.com/

I agree with you Lanna. A dog's agression is directly related to its genes (unless it is treated improperly of course).

But I also think it can be both genetics and its treatment. I think it can sometimes be the owner's fault. Not always, but a lot of the time it is. I've been volunteering at a humane society for 3 years and I've seen a lot. I find that some owners never tried to take their dog to obedience class or work with a trainer to see if it helps. They just "throw it away" at the first sign of aggression. It's like if you never teach a kid to read, he's never going to learn. If you don't train the dog with patience and discipline, he's never going to learn what is okay and what is not. One of my dogs snapped at a little kid, but the kid was squeezing her muzzle. She (the dog) is a 70 lb Irish Setter and is so gentle. I think little dogs are sometimes nastier than big ones. Sure, they aren't dangerous but they can be really annoying since they nip at ankles and yap. I :heart: big dogs. Little ones are just like cats to me. :P

i really agree with Wooligans..

but as for the pits go, i dont.. when im 18, (on the 22nd woooo coming up! :D) i plan to start making petitons going round my neighbor hood and my city haveing people sign them to save the pits from being banned in Minnesota. and i'm plannin on starting a group for the pits. ihave two friends that are from Canada and they have a rescue for Pit Bulls.. and they have two now that are for free, since the pit bulls were banned in their area.. i'm planning on taking them. they are Pit Lab cross. they are not full. but i still would like to have them. their names are Andy and Anne. brother and sister. all i have to do is pay for shipping. and they are mine. i plan on buying a full pit to walk around the neighbor hood. and i plan on owning a Rescue Group for all these "Mean" Dogs. i will rescue Pits, Rotties, Dobes, Staff, Great Danes, Grey Hounds, (i know they arent labled as being mean, but they need the help just as much as the pits do. poor greay hounds :() etc. esp the Rotties and the Danes.. those are the most sweetest dogs i've ever met! i remember when my family friends had their Rottie, i ALWAYS wanted to take it home with me. whenever i see a Rottie in the shelter (i might be going today! :D :D YAY) (my mom gets freaked out by how big they can be.) i am the first one to go up to the dog, and that dog will be licking my hands like CRAZY! i remember this oen time at Petsmart for adoption days, they had this Rottie sitting out and it was for a kissing booth. you give a 1.00 and you let the dog kiss you, well when i bent down, that dog attack me with KISSES!!! LOL.. i fell to the ground because the dog was kissing me! LOL i just love the Rotties.. my friend has a Rottie named Hydes. sweet sweet dog! BUT they abuse her.. and after all that, Hydes is still this VERY sweet dog. if the mom shows her fist to the dog the dog goes off and hides. :( her dad is in a Motocycle Gang, and they ot Hydes for Protection purposes. that dog LOVES everyone who walks in that door.

i feel bad for her, and i want to take her.. now the people behind me have a German Shepard. Della is SCARED of new people.. her privous owner abused her sooooo badly! he periced her ears to make her look even more tough. she is a sweet dog if she gets to know you.. whenever she sees me outside shes always barking for me to pet her. but i wont, the owner scares me soo badly that i wont go near to where their backyard is. my neighbors next to me are moving and i want to say i'll take Taylor in.. even though Taylor is the breed of dog that i HATE.. Mini Schounser (sp) but Taylor loves me MORE than her owners! she lets me pick her up, she lets me do things that she wont let her owners do.. all because when they had their first baby they yell at her for Logan pulling her hair or somethign like that.. and when i babysit and logan does that which causes Taylor to bit him. i yell at logan, because she would never do that if he didnt do that. and i believe in yelling at the person or animal who started it first.. most of the time i catch him before he does it and i yell at him. but now that they have another kid, im worried that they are gonna put her to sleep, and i'd rather take her in. and i want to sooo badly.. one time when i went over there to babysit, the dad SMACKED Taylor with his shoe. i was just about to walk out of there WITH Taylor! when he did that she hid behind me. she knew she was safe behind me.. the dad NEVER liked Taylor in the first place, Taylor is the moms dog, and even the mom will even hit her. most of the time its for BARKING! my lord! terriers are the barkers. its not her fault.. thank god they dont use the shock coller. if they did then thats when i would take it off of her and distroy it, and take Taylor into my house.

but ALL of the dogs i have met are SOOOOOOOO sweet! all of the dogs at the shelter i pet everyone for a long time.. my mom and i spend an hour there playing with the dogs. we will go in to see the rabbits.. pet them for awhile, if there are cute kittens we will o see them.. (my mom is scared of cats, because she was attacked by one when she was younger) but most of our time are with the Dogs. i still have Hank's picture on my wall, same with Snoops, and Annie. out of all three of them, i miss Annie the most. Annie is a Merle Great Dane, omg! i LOVE HER SOO MUCH!!! when i saw her in there the 2nd time (returned doesnt like other animals) i just about cried because i knew she wouldnt find a great home, since she doesnt like other pets she'd have to be the only pet.. i dunno what happend to her after i left.. but when i saw her again i was like "ANNIE!!!!" she saw me and came stright to the front of the kennel, and i was petting her for the rest of the time.. i wouldnt let anyone eles touch her when i was with her. i miss her soooo much! my mom is one of those people who gets scared of BIG dogs or those "mean" dogs, if she doesnt know them from a puppy. and so she didnt like Annie much. see for me i am FEARLESS when it comes to Dogs! Dogs are my LIFE.. i love them sooo much.. i would seriously die for a dog if i had to. thats how much i love them! 'n Jackson is letting me Breed Great Danes, and i know he's gonna let me own a rescue group for dogs.. because he said i can have/do whatever i want to. :D

The first thing people need to remember is that dogs are pack animals. Always have been, and always will be. It's not a trait we can breed out. You have to from day 1 show the dog that you are the Alpha of the pack. Your children need to show the dog that they are higher ranking then that dog. If you don't do it, they will try to up there position in the pack, therefore showing agression. It's not the dog's fault, it's the owners fault for not teaching that dog where it ranks in the family. Dog's don't wake up and decide to attack their owners because they don't like them anymore. Aggression only stems from the dogs rank and the owner provoking them to bite.

If people are going to go and say Pit Bulls are horrible dogs, they are nothing but a bad of agression, well then you are going to have to add a whole bunch of other breeds in there with them. What about all the other breeds that were bred to agression? Bull fighting? Bear fighting? Hunting? Are you going to include all of those breeds in there? When is that last time you heard about a Bull Dog attacking someone? Those breeds were bred for attacking bulls, it's what they were made for. You can't descriminate against one breed and not the others. I myself adore Pit Bulls, along with all of the other "dangerous" breeds out there, including Akita's, which are my favorite breed, and Chows.

With that said, I have to agree about if the dog bites it's gone. I do not tolerate bad behavior in animals, there are too many good ones out there to put up with the bad ones. Our newest dog, Bella, who is a 10lb little poodle/yorkie mix has recently decided to move her way up in our pack, and has bite me on two occasions, both times drawing blood. Unfortunantly she is not my dog, otherwise she would not be living under the same roof as me.

Ya, I included those in my little tirade against Pits, LOL. I wouldn't own any of those either. But they're not being horribly overbred here like Pits. I don't support Pit Bull banning, but I do support spaying a neutering laws for them here. I bet if I opened the paper right now there would be 30 ads for Pit Bull puppies. Are they paying attention to temperment when they breed these Pits? Heck no, they're just taking any Pit they can get their hands on and breeding them together to make a quick buck. It's really sad and horrible. I totally agree that not all Pits are bad! I used to work at Petsmart and the dog trainer there had a super sweet Pit. But I would never own one because I have children, and it's not worth the risk to me. I am not a risk taker.

How funny, I just went to check my yahoo mail and this was on the news sidebar:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051218/ap_on_...it_bull_attacks

my great Aunt and Uncle have a Chow, her name is Tasha, and shes all white.. she is sooooo cute and sweet! i love her! i havent seen her in a long time though :( they got her from one of her husbands kid.. because she doenst like kids. but she doesnt seem like it because she also loves my cousins, lol

i just scaned it because its to long to read when you have a head ach and a chest pain.. but it doesnt say anywhere that i see of what kind of dog attacked her. for all we knowit could've been a Golden.

The first paragraph of article:
"A Virginia lawmaker is proposing tough legislation to punish dog owners whose pets injure or kill, following a fatal attack on an elderly widow by three roaming pit bulls."

A few paragraphs down:
"In the absence of a specific law, the woman who prosecutors say owned the pit bulls, Deanna Large, faces trial Tuesday on a charge of involuntary manslaughter. It is the first time in Virginia a dog owner will be prosecuted on such a charge in a fatal mauling."

okay missed it.. like i said im having my head achs and chest pains again so i dont like to do anything on the computer now.. thats what im watchign a movie, lol

Aww, it's okay. It's a long article. Hope you feel better soon. I wish I could watch TV, but my kids are hogging it.

thanks.. my headach is just cause by a pinched nerve, and i just get panic attacks.. its a really ood movie on Lifetime, called White Orleanderer. (sp?) i love it

Oh I will definantly agree to that. Because Pit Bulls are in high demand people will breed them just to make a quick buck. That however does not mean that ALL Pit Bulls are ferocious. Temperment needs to play a role in breeding anything, them included. I think that a well bred Pit Bull can make the best pet in the world, for children included. But that does not mean you can take one off the streets and ask for a perfect pet (though I am sure it can and has happend).

it oes with all the animals.. people will breed them just for the money.. thats the kind of people i got Missey from. 60$ without any kinds of papers or anything.

It's Staffordshire Bull Terriers here... it's heartbreaking to see them all in the rescues. Unfortunately, alot of staffies don't get on well with other dogs and would probably be more aggressive towards the rabbits (and with 4 house rabbits I couldn't have that). So that's why we ended up with a border collie instead.
We have herders rather than fighters. Staffies are great with people, kids, the lot... but have been so overbred it's unbelievable! :tsk:

As for a dog biting, I disagree... Rolo used to bite us when we first got him. We persevered and for the main part he's a happy dog. He steals from the bin sometimes, but that's our fault for not closing it properly. He has never bitten for no reason... usually it's been because he's felt threatened. And the last time he bit was a long time ago!
Also if it's been an unprovoked attack, I'd always check for a medical problem first.
Only after these things would I have to admit defeat. Animals are not humans, they don't know the boundaries that humans know unless they are taught. These are things that, often with rescue dogs, haven't been learnt.

Sam is a yappy, biting jack russell in rescue. He gives you a warning stare, his tail goes stiff, a sharp growl then he lunges at you, for NO reason! You could be stroking his ears or being so nice to him and he'll bite you. That is the kind of dog that should never be homed with children or owners with low tolerance/knowledge. His owner spoilt him and let him get away with everything, then the man died and the dog, spoilt and not knowing his place, got aggressive. The widow practically danced down the path when she dropped the dog off... <_< (of course she said he was a lovely boy! :rolleyes:)

I don't think it matters what breed you have... They are dogs... Any dog can bite... :dunno:


Oh and Cinn, you're totally right. There are too many people who breed just for money... Come work at rescue for a week and you'll see the amount of nitwits, for want of a better word, that breed willy nilly as if it's a competition to churn out as many bodies as possible. I just want to scream at them sometimes. :angry:

Some breeds do tend to fit certain stereo types better than others, and animals in a high demand are just way to over breed often w/o care what the consiquinces are for health, behavior and temperment. i believe it is both learned and genetic.

I see alot of dogs at work and you get to see first hand what buttons you can push when you are holding for injections, or xraying, sedation etc. i would have to say as a breed, the dogs who seem to have the most agressive behaviors t'wards us are Shar pei's and chow chow's. now don't get me wrong we've had agressive dogs in prob every breed we have seen, but for majority that has been the number 2 dogs.

but there has been an agressive dog in every breed that has ever been, just some breeds there have been a larger number, why because they were bread and created for certain jobs and because certain dogs have that "mean look" the wrong type of people get their hands on them and either breed for profit, puppy milling, or train to be "mean" or both and end up breeding agressive dogs which in turn turn out dogs with a higher chance of aggressiveness.

another reason why particular dogs do such dammage when they do attack is also in how they were breed, look at the pit bull it was breed to have the massive power and jaw and once it gets ahold forget it.

I like pit bulls, i also like rotti's and shepards and dobies, No I do not have any of the above.

I do agree that alot of agressive behaviors have been created either by way of training or lack of training, or by an agressive dog being used as breeding stock.

I do think some people let their animals get away with to much, thinking it's wrong to correct or punnish bad behavior, but they learn by rewards and correction and scolding. in a pack dogs receive this from other dogs so they know what is socially acctable. if a person doesn't want to realize that it's an on going job that needs work, or is unwilling to put the effort into it, or thinks it's wrong to ever tell a dog no, then i don't personally feel they should have a dog.

and just because a person is afraid of a particular breed does not give them the right to say they should all be banned or killed (we had a lady in our office who had a fit there was a pit bull in the waiting room with her and said all of "those type breeds" should be wiped from the face of the earth), if we followed through like that on every animal someone didn't like or even a group of people, there wouldn't be any left on the planet.


I have also found more little dogs to be nippy and agressive than more larger dogs, and seriously a small dog can do some dammage if given optunity, for example you are sitting on floor or couch and the dog gets in your face or neck, one my co workers had a 15 lbs dog attached to her hand just last week.

now i tend to like alot of dogs alot of sizes, but yes i do have my preferences. and i tend to prefer med to extra large dogs, but we do currently have a small dog in that i just adore..
it all depends on the dog..

I don't think though you can punnish an entire breed though for some stupid humans doing stupid stuff.regulating who is breeding, what they are breeding and how often would prob be a better angle to go for that, but you will always have those who break the law or rules and try to sneek things.

Oh and we have had some nice Shar pei's and chow chow's, but they are far and few between, it doesn't mean that i prejudge all of them, but some times we are a bit more cautious with them.

other things that are breed related for example is a large majority of for example rotti's get cancerours tumors in their legs, cockers tend to have bad ears, eyes and skin, .. however not all of them get it, but a large number do, i'd have to say ailments per breed are far more accurate.

And I for one will never have human children, just furry/featherd ones...