- edited -

I'm sorry if I upset some people with the post that I did, but in all honesty, if some people found it disturbing they could of PM'd me and I would of taken the post out.

It would be nice if some people could communicate a little better so that a post can be taken out by the poster than having to find that it has been closed.

Some people I know here knew the other person and I thought I was doing the right thing, obviously not.

Pipp I'm sorry but Lenci was mentioned on the other.


Again I am very sorry if I upset anybody, but how was I supposed to know if nobody told me ????

Anyway thats my quibble. Now back to normal.

Yikes Barmey, that's not what I meant at all!! I thought it was a WONDERFUL gesture on the part of the poster (that was you?) to update us on a person and a bunny many of us knew and couldn't get any info on on our own. Thank you for that!

I just thought it was very sad because of the stupid politics that Tina most likely wouldn't have appreciated it. She really does seem to hate us (as does Carolyn and Gypsy, seeing as we're naming names). :(

I would have hoped that all that would have been set aside when Lenci was ailing as well and that the people would have been allowed to reach out -- and vice-versa -- right from the get-go. But no mention of Lenci ended up on the other board until it was specifically approved by the moderator. It was just too little, too late for me.

It would be nice to adopt a 'bunnies without borders' program that really would do away with all this and just help the bunnies (and owners) who want to reach out regardless of forum loyalties. <sigh>

SAS and Pipp

Pipp I love the caption to your siggy now :ROFL:

And I really wasn't aware of all this forum loyalties stuff and that people would get so offended because someone cared enough to mention their rabbit on another forum. Wow.

I like living in my ignorant, blissful, happy bunny little world. :thumbup:

Yes is was me that did the post.

I hate politics of all kinds.

"Bunnies without Borders" sounds like a good name for something. Hmmmm

Away, life goes on, everyday is a learning curve.

I'm not one for holding things against anybody, I say my piece then carrying with things. Life is too short for petty arguments of any sorts, whether it be on the internet or in real life (you know what I mean).

Hugs and Kisses to Everybun.

:drunk:

"Bunnies Without Borders" sounds like a wonderful concept to me!!

Barmey....I'm glad you let us know about Tina and Misty. She was one of the *very* few people I liked over there.

I'm not sure what all is going on, but I certainly didn't close that thread due to the situation of anyone's ill rabbit, etc.,

The fact that someone was doing home euthenasia was the concern and upsetting for some members.

This is a board where we want to represent good practice of reliable care for our pets. Also to have the support and friendship of other rabbit freaks :)

What someone chooses to do in their own home is their business, but I don't want to seem to support a very controversial situation such as that.

I hope you understand. I thought I had explained this pretty well when I posted and then had to close the subject.

I do feel bad for any bunny passing (or animals, people, etc.,) but it was the details of other things that was disturbing, not who it was about.

I do not see any other board as a "rival" board. We have our board, others are around. All are welcome here. I also believe that the more boards and stuff out there for people about rabbits will educate people about them. Rivals are trying to kill each other out. That's not my agenda at all.

Thanks Kismet, coming from the queen of the siggies, that's really a ocmpliment! :D

You've got the right attitude -- fun in the sun with the buns! :coolbun:

My quibble wasn't with the posts, it was with the fact there were quibbles about the posts, but that got lost in the translation. B)

Yes, you did explain this pretty well, and then you closed the thread and that initiated my quibble. It was tongue-in-cheek, but I stand by the first few lines of my post. I know its the moderators' forum, but in effect by airing your concerns (which I thought was great, I hadn't realized the problems that could have occurred) and then cutting off the discussion, its a little too much like the "It's my ball and I'm going home,' attitude predominent elsewhere. (Although in that case, it's "It''s MY ball, MY stick and MY field, get the :raar: outta here!").

I thought Gypsy had valid points as well (which in effect supported your stand), and I think any forum is a better place when all voices are allowed to be heard (at least once) and the members are allowed to make up their own minds.

I've said my piece, and I'm grateful that this is a forum that allows me to say it without kicking me out! That's all. :)

So can we settle it? No more quibbling? :dance:

Bunnies without Borders! :lophop:

SAS :pinkbun: and Pipp :happybun:

I see what you are saying, but I guess the idea was to keep from having an argument. With as many complaints as I received, I think the majority ruled on this one.

Remember, you don't always see everything on the board that the mods/admin see in the background. We have to make decisions based on what has been brought to us. We also aren't perfect, and there aren't always perfect answers, but we want to keep things on the basis of what professionals would do.

What I know is that in this state, Vets would lose their license for suggesting such a thing. If someone said something to the "wrong" person..... that vet and the person doing such a thing could be held liable for animal cruelty.

Chew on that a bit and then think of what you would do in our place as site admin/owners/moderators.

I really admire our admins and mods. It's gotta be hard to #1 not get involved in the debates ;) #2 Decide what is best for the forum without your own emotions/opinions getting in the way. I'm sure it's a harder job than it looks!

I thought Bo did the right thing locking that thread. I can see where both sides are coming from...but not everyone knew the whole story about Tina's vet being on the phone with her and telling her to do that, etc....Someone could get the wrong message reading that without knowing the whole story (eg. if you don't want to take your bunny to the vet to get it put to sleep just give it pills) and cause some serious damage or pain to their bunny. You never know who is reading but not posting, some people do lurk on bunny forums just for information. Something like that could cause some serious harm.

Thank you Kismet. I'm trying to explain some of what you said exactly.

We have to be responsible for what is said on this board.

I like to let everyone discuss what they want and mostly how they want but we do have to censor some stuff. It's hard sometimes and I struggled with it last night because I felt bad because it was about the loss of a pet as well.......

Bo....You already know, I support your decision. It's one of those issues you have to take a stand on since inevitably anything read and copied from here is our resposiblity as well. I shudder to think that anyone would read that and decide to help their bunny along without the knowledge or skills to do so. Sometimes hard decisions have to made...not everyone will like them...but they still have to be made.

Yes, avoiding an argument is paramount. In a perfect world, people argree to diagree and move on. That's what moderators are supposed to encourage. (Thus the term 'moderator').

I would have done almost exactly what you did -- post a strong statement warning people against home euthanasia -- had I been smart or at least educated enough to know about the pitfalls. But I wouldn't have locked the thread. The end result would have had Gypsy posting in that same thread (perhaps a bit less riled), and all the people who are agreeing with you here would have also posted in that same thread agreeing with you there, and nobody would have had a quibble. :)

Kis, there were two threads -- the first one was locked before Gypsy presented the part about the vet supervision, so I'm not sure what you mean when you agree that the thread should have been locked, but also say that it was good to know there was vet supervision. :unsure: Other than that, I agree with you wholeheartedly!! :)

SAS :pinkbun: and Pipp :happybun: (who may or may not share my opinion).

The decision to lock the thread was made to hopefully let the thread die. Unfortunately it didn't and others were created.

As you said, we hope to agree to disagree. I made the decision I did and the moderator/admin team is in agreement with it.

Believe it or not, we all discuss a lot of things and ask each other what we all think.... if someone told me they didn't agree I would listen. I have listened, but I don't agree here.

If I'm taking my ball and going home..... I guess I'm a big brat that needs a nap! :lol:

LOL! The thread DID die, it's THIS thread that carried it on. I guess opening my big trap did NOT have the desired effect. But hey, I said my piece. (No bite marks on this tongue) B)

Anyhoo, it's a very nice ball, and we're very glad you're letting us play. :bounce:

SAS :stick: and Pipp :hophop:

Well, yes, a couple of threads had to continue it. Still, the decision remains to end it.

With that, I hope the discussion has come to an end because I really had planned on enjoying the other posts tonight.

Otherwise, I guess we'll have Ang here later and it can be taken up to her or I will be on tomorrow at some point..... but I won't guarantee I'll play. :haha:

The reason Gypsy's thread was locked was because she was trolling... i.e. posting an inflammatory message to cause disruption. Rule 7 of this forum states - Trolling, flame baiting, netspeak and flaming are not allowed. She was attacking a member which violates Rule 5 - Personal attacks will not be tolerated. She broke Rule 1 when she joined here... Rule 1 - Treat others as you want them to treat you. unless of course she wants to be lied to, attacked and conned...
Oh look 3 strikes Bo, Kate, Dapy and Lanna!

Quote from Rules...
We operate on a 3 strikes and you're out policy. If however, someone posts something which is deemed to be extremely offensive, you may be banned instantly. Again, Administrators and Moderators have the final decision.

The rules are there to protect the members of our forum. Young children (Rule 4 - ... if it is not suitable for an 8 year old to hear or see, don't post it) reading about euthanising a rabbit through giving it tablets may see that and do something terrible! I don't want this forum to be responsible for cruelty to any animal. We have a responsibility to our members.
The other reason was that if we were to leave that topic, it would have turned into a slanging match. Something that we try to avoid here to prevent feelings being hurt and friendships being lost. Also, when lots of people disagree with others, it can turn into bullying and we will NOT have bullying here. It's childish, hurtful and really should not be tolerated in the adult world.

We are not acting all high and mighty... I know what the general consensus is about Gypsy and it isn't pretty... Not many people would've bitten their tongues with her.
New members who have nothing to do with this will be caught up in what would basically be a brawl and we need to prevent that happening.

Good call to take a stand on the 'do-it-yourself euthanismn' -

and I love the concept of 'bunnies without borders'! :D

Three cheers for our moderators!!! :clap: :clap: :clap:

I completely support their decision to lock the threads that were locked and then allowing this discussion....without banning anyone!! What a concept!!

You guys are the best! :dance:

:innocent: ok for the last time will someone please explain to me why all the exciting threads happen while i am camping?!?!?!?! :innocent:

So you have something good to read when you get back from your adventures! :)

To clarify, seeing as everything got so muddled because of numerous issues convoluted into one…

I never stated an opinion on euthanasia because that wasn’t the issue, the issue was not allowing a thread to continue for people to express their opinions.

This forum had taken great pride in posts on abortion, gay marriage and everything else, those threads were allowed to continue, there were no dramatics or even heated discussion. It wasn't a big deal, but I thought that flew out the window on this issue IMO, because of personal feelings. So I said something. My concern was that the thread was not allowed to continue also because the initial issue was coming from somebody from a rival forum the moderators didn’t like. Ditto with the post offering additional information supporting that person made in another thread. I thought Gypsy’s post was reasonable and without obvious malice. I respect that the moderators run the forum and they’re free to do what they like, but I just wanted to plant the seed that their judgment in this case may have been clouded and to consider they might be doing the very things they hated about their former home. I pointed that out, and then considered the subject closed.

However, to sink myself deeper B) , going back to the euthanasia issue, I’ve thought about it, and I personally think it was the right thing to do. I admired Tina for doing it at the time, that hasn’t changed. That is my opinion. I can’t stand to see an animal in pain, and it was painfully obvious this baby was going to die. I sincerely hope that if I’m dying and in pain, that someone will do that for me. I’m putting that in my living will. I appreciate that others won’t agree, and theories of life and the law can be endlessly argued, but this issue is no more contentious in principle than the ones noted above, so I see nothing wrong with stating an opinion. I’m not looking for, nor expecting, an argument. Of course I have no problem with others stating opinions to the contrary. And that’s how it should be.

All along, I’ve simply tried to be a peacemaker. I’ve been trying to point out that people, forums and issues all have good points and bad. They shouldn’t be viewed with blanket feelings. Now yet again I’m asking that the matter should be dropped and everybody have a group hug. :group:

This board is taking up too much of my time, so I won’t be around much to socialize. I've got to get to work! :woot: I’ll keep my options open re: advice for Pipp, seeing as she’s the prime directive. :lurve: I’ll also be looking around for other advice forums, the more the merrier, so if anybody knows of any, feel free to drop me a line. my address is in my profile. Also feel free to email for advice I may be able to offer, I'm always available if somebunny needs help!

SAS (and Pipp) :cheerybye:

PIPP I haven't read your whole post but I will tell you this much from what I have...

There is a huge difference between a thread directly debating something and one that just puts a controversial issue in the midst of a very sad situation.

Had someone posted in the debate forum: Do you believe in home euthanasia

It would have stayed.

Now, you have stated your opinion over and over on the board and in pm. It's done and guess what? I'm locking THIS thread.

EDIT:

I also want to say now that I have read all of this and discussed some of it with you, that sometimes situations don't have a good answer. We do what we can and sometimes it doesn't make others happy.

No one said there couldn't be a thread for Misty and Tina remade without the support of home euthanasia present.

No one said there couldn't be a thread in the debate section about that subject. Actually, it looks like if someone's into a good heated discussion.... that might be one! :blink:

If anyone has a concern about something like reposting with edits..... PLEASE ask one of the admin or mods. If they don't answer immediately, they might just want to talk it over with the others. We don't bite here. We welcome your questions like that. No one is "out to get the others" and going to black ball you if you happen to have a friend they don't like.

If I was so cold as to not want someone posting about a friend's pet dying, I would hate myself. I would love to know where that opinion of me comes from. If you really knew the person I am.... you would understand that can't happen.

I am the person who lets her own house go so I can go clean for someone I barely know because they have an ill child. I am the person who checked on a woman who got injured recently, eventhough she was so nasty and hateful to a lot of people at a kids function. As I have said over and over. I hated to close that thread because of Misty.

I certainly don't feel we have mimicked things we don't like about other forums. All forums have rules, ideas, and people. Not everyone will agree. Just because there is a debate it shouldn't become so upsetting that someone leaves. I'm not that petty, nor should anyone else be.

For the record; I have no problem with PIPP and she should know that. I just want to make sure you all know that as well. We just need to get a handle on this emotional topic and issue.