I posted this in the news section, and some one suggested I post it here as well.

Here's the rest of the article:
http://baldur.globalsymmetry.com/fact911/glaring-proof.html

Please feel free to circulate this challenge. If you know of anybody who can meaningfully meet that challenge, please send email to hattons at Global Symmetry (one word) dot com.

I cannot stress strongly enough that this is clear simple, irrefutable proof. Use it! If you know a physicist, show him[1] the article. If he says I am wrong, then tell him to provide the proof. If he declines to do so, tell him that I consider him unqualified to call himself a physicist.

[1]Yes, I know I am using "offensive", "sexist" language, but I refuse to mutilate the English language to appease thought police.

Please consider posting your appreciated work in the following locations as well to reach more people:

http://911Debates.com
http://911Blogger.com

Thanks and watch http://WKJO.com if you haven't yet.

real good,we should all read this

Have you never built a campfire and seen the embers glow?

Last year I was camping with some other dads, and one of the logs we were burning had a chain completely embedded in the log. It was not visible before the fire, but started showing itself later. Besides being pretty interesting by itself, the point I'm bringing out here is that when we finally got the chain free, it was glowing. And it didn't even have the advantage of being in a big insulating pile of debris.

chucksheen is like a talking encyclopedia of awesomeness that thumps its huge thick binder on the table making a loud THWACK noise

THWACK


THWACK



THWACK


THWACK

It's there:
http://911debates.com/forums/viewtopic.php...17bc2829f99e4fd

Be sure you open the comments: http://911blogger.com/node/11376#comment-161240

Notice that they felt the need to remove me, but not my "offensive" comments. Strange that, eh? Even stranger, I was the one who suggested they take the "H" discussion to a different forum, and that is the only thing I said on the matter. They have an agenda and it is not full discovery.

http://WKJO.com
Definitely a trustworthy beacon in the darkness. I have followed up on a good deal of it. IIRC, he did not mention Lewis Paul Bremer III, nor Heinz, other than in passing, if at all.

I believe this is important:
http://vehme.blogspot.com/2007/03/conspira...ith-decamp.html

This would be much stronger if they hadn't tacked on the extraneous political spiel near the end. Nonetheless, it is clear that Iran-Contra was the cover-up, not the crime:
http://vehme.blogspot.com/2007/01/clinton-chronicles.html

If you can find Hopsicker's "American Drug Lords", that's worth a watch.

If George Herbert Walker Bush wasn't one of the shooters in Dealey Plaza, he damn-sure at least knows who they were.

http://vehme.blogspot.com/2007/01/jfk-geor...a-cia-link.html

I built many a fire in my life. Please show me an example of a diffuse hydrocarbon fire producing a stream of brightly glowing material which has the characteristics of molten metal.



http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2...145858863&hl=en

This phenomena has to be observable in broad daylight.

My biggest problem with this issue is trying to get people to realize how irrefutable and powerful this very simple evidence is. I'm glad we have courageous people such as Barry Jennings, Willy Rodriguez, John Schroeder, etc. The work of people such as Dr. Jones, Kevin Ryan, et. is also extremely important. The evidence I am pointing to is totally "in your face" and cannot be refuted.

Moved to World Trade Center.

getting them out of the lounge and into other forum catagories is a feat by itself. :)

Hetware:

This explanation of what happened in WTC 2 is just as likely as your thermite scenario:

Localized Oxygen-Enhanced Fires in WTC 2

Information available on U.S. FAA websites, and confirmed in the NIST NCSTAR 1-5 report, indicate that the Boeing 767 aircraft involved in the 9-11 impacts on the WTC Towers carried a number of oxygen cylinders and oxygen generators. A NASA report by T. L. Reynolds, (No. NASA/CR-2001-210903, issued in May 2001), discusses Onboard Oxygen Gas Generating Systems, or OBOGS, and other sources of breathable oxygen on aircraft:

“Oxygen systems, as they are currently designed for use on commercial transport aircraft, include passenger oxygen for use in the event of a sudden loss of cabin pressure (provided by either compressed oxygen or solid chemical oxygen generators) and gaseous oxygen for use by the flight deck crew. There is also portable gaseous oxygen available for medical use and for protective breathing equipment. The use of oxygen on commercial aircraft, required by FAA regulations, does pose a potential fire safety hazard because of the extremely high gas combustion temperatures that can be produced by combustible materials burning in either pure or oxygen-enriched air environments. This is true of any oxygen system in any environment.”

The standard oxygen cylinder carried on all U.S. commercial aircraft contains 3200 liters of O2 stored at 1850 psi when full. Details of the over-pressure relief of these cylinders are provided in a FAA report by T. R. Marker et al., (No. DOT/FAA/AR-TN98/29):

“Different types of pressure relief devices are used for storing breathable oxygen. There are two types of rupturing relief valves, a frangible disc that will fail under excessive pressure (typically 2500 psi) and a thermal disc that will fail when the temperature exceeds 165°F or 225°F, depending on the type. The rupture disc pressure relief device is the only type used on gaseous oxygen cylinders for crew and passenger breathing systems on commercial transport aircraft….. Ironically, the rupture disc type pressure relief devices pose a more serious concern in a fire environment because, with these relief devices, it is possible for the entire contents of the oxygen cylinder to be discharged at elevated temperatures.”


Marker’s report describes studies showing that rupture disc failure occurs within 15 minutes for cylinders exposed to temperatures as low as 200° C.

The standard chemical oxygen generator used in the OBOGS on commercial aircraft consists of a small metal canister equipped with a spring-loaded striker. When activated, a “candle” of sodium chlorate and additives such as barium peroxide undergoes spontaneous thermal decomposition releasing oxygen gas. The OBOGS units installed on most Boeing aircraft contain about 250 grams of NaClO3 per canister that generate about 50 liters of O2 in 12 minutes – an amount of oxygen considered sufficient to supply two passengers during an emergency descent.

NIST report that the Boeing 767s involved in the 9-11 impacts on the WTC Towers carried about 100 canisters per aircraft; each canister capable of 12-minute oxygen generation for a total of 5000 liters of O2 per aircraft; the canisters were located in compartments above the passenger seats. Researcher D. Blake, in a study of the response of aircraft oxygen generators to elevated temperatures, (See report No. DOT/FAA/AR-TN03/35), found that the lowest temperature for self-activation of a generator canister was 315° C. Other tests conducted by Blake showed that more than 80 % of generator canisters heated to 370° C activated during an hour of heating.

Based on the experimental data presented above it appears quite probable that a significant portion of the oxygen carried by the two aircraft that hit the Twin Towers was released prior to the collapse of these buildings. Experimental data also show that gas cylinders undergo acute release of oxygen at much lower temperatures than the chemical generators onboard the aircraft. Furthermore, the chemical generators release oxygen in 50-liter increments involving many locations in the aircraft cabin, while the bottled gas supply would be released in one 3200-liter pulse at the front-end of the aircraft fuselage where the cylinder is wall-mounted.

In one of the tests described by Marker, 600 liters of oxygen was released into a cargo container where a small fire had been deliberately set. The initial discharge of oxygen caused a very violent combustion reaction that ripped open, and subsequently destroyed, the container. Other data from fire tests in oxygen-enriched environments show that cellulose-based materials such as wood, cardboard and paper, burn almost four times faster in air enriched to 40 vol % O2. This increased combustion rate induces a comparable increase in the heat flux from the burning material and results in flame temperatures as much as 600° C higher than the flame for the same material burning in air – thus flame temperatures up to 1500° C are possible.

Based on the calculated trajectory of UA Flight 175 inside WTC 2, the forward cabin area of the aircraft ploughed into floors 80 to 82 of the northeast corner of the building. Thus the 3200-liter oxygen cylinder carried in the crew compartment of Flight 175 came to rest precisely in the area where the bright yellow glow was to later appear. As many videos show, about 50 minutes after impact, fires were well established in localized areas of the northeast corner of WTC 2 – these fires would have gradually heated the entire forward fuselage to temperatures in excess of 200° C. We therefore suggest that the intense yellow glow seen moments before the collapse of WTC 2 was caused by the discharge of the onboard oxygen cylinder and the subsequent enhancement of the pre-existing fires.

Flight 175 that NIST claims struck WTC2 at approximately 540+ mph though they needed to increase the speed to 570 mph in their computer model to achieve collapse initiation in the worse case scenario.

So you are claiming that this high speed collision, one which totally destroyed the aircraft, leaving only the severely mutilated titanium steel components like engines and landing gear as identifiable; that somehow this 3200 litre oxygen cylinder survived undamaged and waited for a 200° C nearby fire to develop and cause it to burst and release it's oxygen and accelerate the fire. Well I guess burst couldn't be right or there would have been only a momentary flash and then the oxygen would be gone. Apparently it just developed a healthy 'leak' then which feed the fire?

Does NIST make such a claim or even raise the remote possibility of such an event occurring?

MM

There's something I've noticed in the video referenced here, that's relevant to this article. At approximately 11 seconds into it there is a visible white glow to the left of the column where the molten metal flow is. It's only visible for a few seconds, but a very noticable white glow in broad daylight. Looks like a flashlight being shined at the photographer. Anyway, my two cents

I think Greening postulated the oxygen in these cylinders may have been an accelerant for a thermite reaction for the aluminum and oxidized iron. Which I suppose suggests the sources of oxygen were leaking. And then on the other hand, a number of the legion of OCTists use the oxygen cylinders as one of the explanations for explosions witnessed in both towers. Hmmm, and they say conspiracy theorists want things both ways.

Seems like an awfully small amount of combinations of elements to cause the destruction witnessed TWICE that day. At any rate, I think the oxygen on the planes would have had a negligible effect on the eventual outcome.

Let me put it this way... If an Oxygen tank had survived intact through the collision, it would obviously turn into a bunch of Hot Air! :lol: :P

I think it's quite possible that the main on-board oxygen cylinder on Flight 175 could have survived the aircraft impact, especially considering the trajectory of the front end of the aircraft within WTC 2. Th O2 cylinder was strapped to the forward fuselage which would have acted like a cushion. The clyinder would only discharge when the pressure-relief disk ruptured due to overheating. That is the way gas cylinders are designed to deal with overheating. The gas release is still relatively controlled...... I have worked with rupture disks, have you?

Hmmm oxygen, office materials, and aluminum. I'm sure you can recreate the phenomenon in the video in order to provide empirical evidence, correct?

I mean it should be reproducible, right. So it is time to start 'reproducing' like the Jone's crew did to prove its point.

Strapped to the fuselage that took the full force of impact. Cushion and 500+ Mph collision makes me think that you may say the bladder for the oxygen mask inflated and acted as an airbag. If you are to believe the official story here then you have to admit that the plane turned into a fragmented blast of debris that stripped all the fireproofing too. So there is no way anything is being cushioned especially by the outer skin of the fuselage which is millimeters of Aluminum.

I say stripped of all fireproofing because partially fireproofed beams were fire tested by UL and passed the workstation tests flawlessly. A guy has come forward from UL and was fired for getting fired up about the heat from the fire not being sufficient to weaken the steel.

Yeah, do experiments and send it in to Mythbusters and see if they will have a go at it.