View Full Version: New Person

Loose Change Forum > Welcome Newcomers! > New Person



Title: New Person


PhoenixOrion - September 11, 2007 06:09 PM (GMT)
Just wanted to say hello to you all. I was viewing some vids on youtube this morning and came upon the loose change vid. It's interesting, I'll give you that. It made me question a lot of what we've all been told to believe. I'm still not sure what I buy into 100% but the vid definitely made me think.

JointPlays - September 11, 2007 06:32 PM (GMT)
Welcome :)

I would recommend you also see these two:

9/11 Mysteries ( Google Video )

And:

9/11 Press for truth (Google Video )

Spread the word, and let people make up their own mind.

But let them see both sides. They have seen one side their hole life sort of speak.


buddy - September 11, 2007 06:34 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (PhoenixOrion @ Sep 11 2007, 02:09 PM)
Just wanted to say hello to you all. I was viewing some vids on youtube this morning and came upon the loose change vid. It's interesting, I'll give you that. It made me question a lot of what we've all been told to believe. I'm still not sure what I buy into 100% but the vid definitely made me think.

Welcome. Glad to hear that you are thinking about it. Usually that's all it takes: realizing that the official story might not be true. Once you consider that, then you can start looking at things more objectively. And even if you don't agree with Loose Change, at least will have made a conscience decision you made yourself, not one supplied to you by the media, fear, peer pressure, or authority.

bmy78 - September 12, 2007 02:24 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (buddy @ Sep 11 2007, 01:34 PM)
QUOTE (PhoenixOrion @ Sep 11 2007, 02:09 PM)
Just wanted to say hello to you all.  I was viewing some vids on youtube this morning and came upon the loose change vid.  It's interesting, I'll give you that.  It made me question a lot of what we've all been told to believe.  I'm still not sure what I buy into 100% but the vid definitely made me think.

Welcome. Glad to hear that you are thinking about it. Usually that's all it takes: realizing that the official story might not be true. Once you consider that, then you can start looking at things more objectively. And even if you don't agree with Loose Change, at least will have made a conscience decision you made yourself, not one supplied to you by the media, fear, peer pressure, or authority.

I would agree with Buddy that being open to new ideas is healthy and the first step in confirming or rejecting claims.

However I would like to quote Carl Sagan when examining anything that challenges an established view: "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence."

Has the Loose Change video produced any extraordinary evidence? After watching an hour's worth of footage (I literally could not stand anymore), I would have to say no. Not only does it fail to produce a single causal relationship between "the government" and the 9/11 attacks, in a few places it even contradicts itself.

Look at each of these events (especially the timeline) and try to figure out how they would be interrelated. Is there any sort of interrelationship here? Out of the dozens of correlative events, is there any direct linkage from one event to another. An answer such as "it must be the government" is not enough to form any claim. Who in the government? The military? Who in the military? Was it a black ops type of unit? What proof is there of any sort of op to exist? Claiming all of this and then stating there would be no proof because it would be highly classified is a cop-out. Again, as Sagan says: "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence."

What do you think is more likely: a) a government plot to which there is zero evidence of its existence (holes in an established theory X is not equivalent to proving alternative theory Y) or B) we are seeing a "after the fact, before the fact" type of faulty, illogical reasoning that is used to defend other erroneous theories of Nostradamus, the Bible Code, the existence of paranormal activity, and intelligent design.

Now I kept an open mind when watching Loose Change. However, when they confused correlative relationships with causal relationships, when they started contradicting itself within the first hour, when such heavy weight was placed on eyewitness testimony (when we all know all sorts of conflicting reports were coming in from jarred, frightened people), I cannot support any of this.

Let me explain this more clearly with an analogy. I bought a VW Jetta in 2004. Thus I started noticing Jettas all over the place after I decided to buy one. If you allow yourself to buy any of these correlative relationships without the skepticism that the scientific mind brings, without any causal relationship evident, then you will start seeing all sorts of relationships in just about everything. It's the same logic that supporters of the Bible Code, Nostradamus, and even intelligent design (though I admit I find those theories much more entertaining) bring to their theories. It is faulty, unscientific, and attacks conventional wisdom without supporting any sort of alternative thesis.

caracho - September 12, 2007 04:10 AM (GMT)
greetings, buildings dont collapse in 10 seconds

bmy78 - September 12, 2007 01:55 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (caracho @ Sep 11 2007, 11:10 PM)
greetings, buildings dont collapse in 10 seconds

Sure they do, you just witnessed it happen in the documentary.




Hosted for free by InvisionFree