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BOO HOO FOR ALL YOU!
What a stupid headline for a topic!
FOR LIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't agree i love the headline. boo hoo for you, you seem to be the one crying about it.

My screen name is Levi Andre. Why? I am Levi Andre and I believe in taking responsibility for what I say. If I believe what I say and it is worth reading, then my name should be on it. It should be consistent information and available to anyone regardless if they agree with me or not. I give very, very little thought to the opinions of anyone who cannot put their real name on what they write. It is not like someone is going to throw a brick through your window (I hope). If it is really that serious then sorry and please, continue anonymously. I would like to include all real names of others but I really don’t know how that works online if I am going to get you in trouble with your boss if they google you and find out you go to LGM. I guess initials work. I don’t mean to be mysterious but also think it is maybe a little imposing to put someone’s name online without permission.

I have been relatively quiet for the last 11 months since I left LGM. I would like to tell my story and offer a few insights based on 7 ½ years in GG/LGM at various levels of involvement. This ranges from skeptical visitor to Bible college student to youth director to missionary, then back to skeptical visitor and now (former attendee). I have continually thought and prayed to God about my time there ever since I left. I am typing this all at one time and not editing any of it. My hope is that it will be helpful to anyone who is in LGM or was involved at one time. It is also a little therapeutic for me to put my thoughts down. I don’t claim to have answers for anyone but I have come to some personal conclusions and maybe this will be another piece of information for you as you sort out tough topics like: Who are YOU? Who is God? What is LGM? Should you be there? Is TP crazy? Etc. If certain parts bore you, don't give up. I think there will be something for everyone here. I know a lot of this is not new and has been said by others but I just want to make it comprehensive for me. .

Background:
I was not raised Christian. My parents went to a weird, legalistic, controlling, charismatic Christian church in southern California before I was born. They realized that it was rotten and moved to Tacoma. The only verbal insight into my spirituality from them when I was a kid was "just do your best to be a good person and you have nothing to worry about." I love my parents (more and more all the time) and I am so thankful to God for them and honestly rejoice that in the last year they have both returned to their faith in Jesus and are actively seeking him.

So I was a curious teenager and went to church (not LGM) with friends. I loved the attention of friendly people but I was also very intrigued by the messages. Sometimes I would come late to skip the cheesy worship and just sit in the back to hear the message. One night, the gospel message came alive and spoke into my soul. I had heard it about 10 times but realized at that moment, I had to give a response. I stayed for the music afterwards and literally felt the Holy Spirit come upon me. I felt joy, security and purpose beyond natural emotion or thought. I didn’t know scripture but I knew for sure I was saved.

Experience at LGM:
My old church had fired their youth pastor and I got distracted by life. I was 17 and I hadn’t been to church for about a year when I was invited by a dear friend RG to GG. I was attracted by the unconditional love of JH and others but mostly to the idea of pure objective teaching from the word of God with evidence behind it. I hated the music (still do (most of it)) and at times was not thrilled about the people but loved thinking I was getting truth about God, from God, the way it was intended. I still believe there was tons of great truth and I benefited tremendously from the friends, and messages as a young believer. I went to Bible college and pretty much devoted my life to the church (class, CAP, teens, Sunday school, dayschool, building project etc. etc.). It sure kept me busy and out of trouble but left absolutely no time to digest what I was being taught or what I really believed. It wasn’t until I went on the mission field that I really ever made the distinction between what I thought and what I was being taught. Sometimes I would hear something that seemed to contradict what I fundamentally knew about the character of Jesus but blew it off by thinking that if I stuck around for a while it would make more sense. I finished bible college and went to Chile. This was a great time to think independently from TP’s messages and hear from God. I realized I was not serving God for the right reasons and I take responsibility for this. I had a fun and constructive couple months there and came home wanting to see what it would be like to just sit and listen in church for a while. I wanted to be intentional about how I served the church instead of just being a yes man. So, I did. It was so boring for me. I felt like I could have told you exactly what TP was going to say before he said it because I had heard it so much before. Maybe I was also bored and unfulfilled because I was not right with God because I really wasn’t. I think the reason I wasn’t right with God was because I was sitting in a church where he clearly did not want me to be. I had very little desire to talk to people about God and definitely was not going to invite them to a church that I got nothing out of.

Why I left:
Maybe someday I will spell out and document all the doctrinal reasons I left (unhealthy pastoral authority, overemphasis on the local assembly, false understanding of fellowship, legalism, exclusion and fear of non-LGM believers.), but I also know these concerns have been raised and blown off. Also, is it necessary? Do I have to state my case and let the elders decide if I am justified to leave or not? What if I just don’t want to go to a struggling confused church anymore? So, I went waay out of my way to get an appointment and meet with TP. I told him my situation and my understanding of the churches situation. I asked if he would consider addressing some of the problems in the church. He went down a list of excuses like it wasn’t a problem, it wasn’t his department, it has already been fixed, he didn’t know about it or (my favorite) it is actually my problem. I would never just leave an organization because they face challenges. I left because leadership was not willing to acknowledge obvious problems. I believe in commitment, integrity, loyalty and riding out bumpy patches. I also know that my relationship to God must always come before my relationship to a church. I also believe a church also has a responsibility to listen to the people, and provide for something besides JUST a place to volunteer. I also think a marriage like commitment to a church is not reasonable or in the Bible. For months, I would show up to LGM out of loyalty etc. but then also go to other churches to actually get fellowship and teaching etc. I was very clear to TP why I was leaving and that it was not why he thought (I had been infected by others, I am an alcoholic, etc. etc.) I don’t want to get into trashy gossip and I can’t prove that he continued to say these things after I left but I really believe he did based on multiple people telling me that he did.

Since then:
I have grown closer to God and reality, I have served my community in the name of Jesus Christ, I have a fresh love for God and people. I am also not so scared of the world that I can’t discerningly take in non Christian ideas and process them. I have traveled, enjoying new friends and places. I care about my community as a whole and relate to people as fellow humans rather than savages. I am not saying life is perfect but it is BETTER. I have had to learn how to think and make decisions with God. I have had to learn how to relate to people without just trying to convert them. It has been scary and hard but I also basically just feel free, at peace and excited about life.

For those still going there:
You will never understand until you take a breather from that place.

Here comes a bit of a rant:
TP, hey. you had a good run. God still loves you the same if you close up shop and focus on him for a while (Him being God, not church). I absolutely believe in the role of church in our Christian walk. But I also believe it has been so distorted by you and many organization leaders that I fear at this stage in your life, you will never change without a miracle. You used to say you didn’t care if you were preaching to 3 people in a living room. I took that to mean that you would keep Christ the focus, even if it was a small number of people. Is Christ the focus in your life or church? I honestly don’t know. I haven’t listened to a message since I left except for one the week after. I am fairly certain it was called something like “let everything be done for edification.” The baseline problem there is a misunderstanding of what we should be “building up.” When people leave your church and are critical of the problems that you deny, they are actually being edifying. You have to clean a wound before the band-aid, you have to drill a cavity before you fill it and you have to correct bad doctrine before developing a church. It may be possible by God’s grace to salvage your church. You obviously have some pretty dedicated people. However, have you honestly asked yourself WHY? “Motivated by the love of God to serve others.” I love that slogan. Does it have to be through your broken, hurting organization? There are literally hundreds and hundreds of great churches in this city! If the goal is to know Jesus and share him with others, is carrying on like you are the best way to do it? I completely understand you want to move on. I would too. You are in a tough position. I hope you believe I want the best for you and your family. People who write about you and your church online are not creating your problems. Even if they all disappeared, the exact same flaws would resurface. Maybe you would have a few years of peace as you raised up the next generation but sooner of later, they are going to smell something fishy. Are you open to the possibility that maybe it would be better to start attending another church? I hope you believe this is not intended to offend. I am taking the risk of being wrong so that maybe if I am right, it will help.

Personally, I choose not to regret the time I spent at LGM. They were some prime years out of my life that could have been spent better but I also could have definitely spent them worse. Currently I am pretty busy but I do invite response to this. I realize some thoughts are pretty bold and not fully explained. If you didn’t relate to any of this, lets just please all agree Life is too short and God is too big to waste our lives on personal or political arguments, I completely understand that those of us that left have to take time to process and heal. I just hope (and believe) it is with the clear goal of recovery at some point. I think about the 29,000 children that die every day from hunger and preventable disease. It is humbling to compare my problems with this reality. I am not saying suck-it-up or get-over-it. I am just saying I hope I don’t look back and say “why did I let that silly situation distract me from what is really important for so long?”

Thanks for letting me share. I am going to go have a beer with some friends now. Bye.

Okay. First, my fav’ joke: How many hippies does it take to screw in a lightbulb? Hippies don’t screw in light bulbs. They screw in dirty sleeping bags!

Ok, I’m done.

I think you pretty well "get it" Levi.

Thanks Table. but who are you?
-Levi Andre

Levi,

Thanks so much for posting. This is exactly what I had in mind when I first created this thread. I had originally asked people to only post on this thread with their real name. It was a place for people to tell what they had experienced when they were leaving. I was not about to get into an argument with people about it I just had hoped people would post without anonymity here. I appreciate your words and your experience. Thank you also for clarifying that you were not "influenced to leave" by others but feel very confident it was your own decision. I do think at some time it would be helpful to others if you would clarify some of the doctrinal stuff too, but thanks for what you have posted so far.

I look forward to continuing fellowship with you no matter where you go.

Greg