The original thread regarding Tacoma can be found here:

http://z10.invisionfree.com/DiscussGGWO/in...wtopic=322&st=0

Someone should print thread # 1 or archive it safely.

Oh yeah, I get to be the first to post. Even before Tilis!

I was trying to quote from the previous thread from the guest who posted about continued GGWO'ers who hear no evil, speak no evil & see no evil. There is a lot of that at LGM. So many will defy basic logic to continue defending the system. It isn't an unusual thing to happen, even in abusive marriages. The unknown sometimes seems scarier than what you are faced with. Or maybe ''some day'' it'll get better. Some have a tendency to say things like , ''there is always someone in a worst position than I am dealing with my petty problems''. Hmmm I don't remember any where in the Bible that God calls us to ignore the obvious because there are people worst off than us. Does anyone?

Quote from Ken Blue, ''Healing Spirutual Abuse''; "One of the most troubling abusive traits in the dysfunctional church or denominational family is the unwritten "no talk" rule. This rule implies that certain problems in the group must not be exposed because then the group might look bad and things would have to change. The "no talk" rule itself is among those things never talked about. Allowing such deception and suppression to exist within a fellowship not only fosters numerous abuses but is a flat denial of the meaning of Christian fellowship. If there are certain issues-such as leadership, decision-making or how money is spent-which you cannot discuss with members of your church, you do not participate in Christian fellowship with them. What you share instead is a commitment to what Schaef and Fasell call the "addictive organization": " Communication in the addictive organization is frequently indirect....People who feel they have conflict with one another refuse to state their conflicts openly to the person concerned. They are also unwilling to discuss these conflicts in public settings. Instead, they avoid the significant parties and carry tales to others."

Are you seeing this good people of LGM.

Mark Aloisio please continue, you are truly entertaining. Could you do some
"Stand Up"!!
We love you and Kim, and so thankful God led you out! :rolleyes:

tilis
Your actions are a direct indication of what is in your heart. It is filled with evil, infectious evil, how can you slander people without proof,even by your own admission. Your lack and disregard of TRUTH is a clear indication that you are not Biblical but are unduly influenced by a mans deception.This is an example of why so many have left, how can you say it is Biblical , your leader says whatever he wants to without any truth, he cannot keep his own mouth shut and you are a direct descendant of him.
You are either:
a high ranking puppet seeking to find out who is on this site for tom powell
a low level wanna bee, do bee who is trying to desperately climb the tom powell ladder.
a fool who has a penchant for stupidity
a fool who needs a real Bible College and a real church and not a corporation
a fool who will listen to anything a man tells them even if it is wrong and still defend that position, by your own admission you have said you did not ask Rich or Dan but yet you believe the evil/slander you heard about one of God's own
a fool who does not know God but can readily tell us about a man(tp) and his twisted vision
Name yourself to give you some credibilty
tilis you owe many people, at the very least an apology, just for your information I was in tbs/ggwo/iagm/lgm for 20 yrs and have never once heard tp give anybody a real, honest apology. Don't be like him for your sake.

Profile of Tilis aka Tilly the Hun

From the sentence structure and word choice in the last post, I would say that Tilis has above average intelligence and a college education. What a waste of skills, Tilis. Who uses the word "thesarus" and makes those kind of spelling/typing errors? So she's not that smart.

She is someone who is on a cause or mission to protect her pastor like a guard dog. So all is fair in love and holy war (gihad) with her. She's like one of those anti-abortionists who thinks its okay to plant bombs in doctor's cars. We're talking about a fundamentalist here.

So she doesn't have much of a life if this is her identity. She's not let's say a practicing professional, but a frustrated secretary or clerk somewhere. She's never really been a part of TP's inner circle, so she is trying to prove her loyalty in her insecurity.

"one more thing, tilis" please don't run away. keep on posting. it just might set you free.

I doubt it. We spend a lot of time measuring our own troubles and then someone comes along and says something like "no matter what we go through, pastor goes through a hundred times worse."

What a load of c*@p. Now we're supposed to sweep more of our own issues that God intends for us to deal with, no matter how small, in to already overloaded closets. I had to leave when I didn't have any more space to hide things. Now I'm dealing with stuff as it comes up and sometimes it's painful, other times it's almost comical how absurd I have behaved while under the influence of that system.

Let it out. Deal with it. Open the closets and don't be afraid of what you find in there. Out with the old, in with the new. It's time for a remodel of the rooms of the soul. No guilt, no fear, no letting the past dictate how we behave in the present. The human brain is an interesting device in that it doesn't just automatically forget the past and start instantly behaving differently. We need to persuade ourselves to function differently. Our gray matter needs to be rewired, and we need help to do it, and it doesn't happen quietly or quickly.

The system that programmed tilis to speak so predictably is still lurking about in the dark recesses of my soul and only light can reveal what needs to be cleaned out. Light shines in when we are open, honest, and have the courage to face difficult truths even when we find ourselves mixed up in the worst of it. Those who love darkness hide and don't address honest questions like the ones we offered tilis. The system taught us that we needed to have answers, while I believe that God wants us to stand up and ask the difficult questions and then have the courage to seek the answers, especially when the answers aren't what we want to hear.

BTW ABC, your cat is one frightening looking creature.

Its that time again.......uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuurrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrKoine Awards!!!!!!!
Tonights Koine Award recipient is.......................................................................
a tie:
Justine Phelps you go girl, even if its late, very well spoken.
Who Me, no not you me, what is this idea of homework???? historian you are

Tonights Berean Award recipient is ....................................................................
Mark "the Gladiator" Aloisio - just balls baby, and father knows best

Very good , heartfelt posts filled with insight and passion.Amore'

The Koine is awarded to the single best post of the day.
The Berean is awarded to the best multiple posts of the day.

All winners will receive an online pat on the back and much admiration. This is not to be confused with approbation lust.

If anyone wants to see me I can be found at:
112th st E. Across from the South Hill Mall bus station. Come meet me , if you have any balls!!!!!!!

Tilis, my back hurts, do you know anyone that can help? By the way that is a lovely silver spoon you have, it must open a lot of doors for you, maybe even the Pastors. B)

What time? You forgot to tell me the time. How am i supposed to meet you if i don't know the time? I think you're a fake, a phony, a fraud. I've been standing here since midnight and you haven't shown up. B)

LGM Tacoma, Home of the Proud and The Slave

Come join us here, A Home of the Free and the Brave Those who come here Bravely admit their mistakes following or being ensnared in your systems. Those who come here bravely will not settle for your evil systems. Those who come here are accepted "Free" freely appreciated because of who they are in Christ and Loved regardless of their standing of approval from you. There relationship to you has no bering here. No accomplishments in your system make a difference. We cast down our crowns and positions gladly. We spit out the nasty substance we were fed.

Listen up....... None of the people here left for the reasons that you think. We left because we had to flee an evil system.

My kitty has just awakened from a very tireing long sleepy slumber. My kitty see's ALL. :rolleyes:

Dan, I dont remeber your questions cause they are on a different site and my computer wont let me click on the link. I dont doubt that any of you love god and you have a point in saying that i have no right to attack you just caus you are attacking pastor. There may be things wrong with the system as you say but why not look past it and contineu just loving god and peple? Why not see Pastor Powell thru his mistakes and flaws... he is just a man, hes not jesus.

I sat with many of you in raps or funstions and listen to you make fun and poke at poeple in the church and then trurn around and act like you loved them. Now you say pastor does it...why is he different from you? his messages have not changed, the music has not changed. so to see such a big change with all of you is miind bogglin.

Second, look im sorry for all my typos i type fast and dont check. Im not trying to cover anything. and why would i wantto name myself when all you guys have been doing on this website is attacking my thogts and opinions.

... I do not have any ill fillings towards Joe and Megan Aloisio. I simply said that they are manipulative people. the kinda people you think Tom Powell to be. I think they flaunt there money and act too good for people, they are like the "cool kids in school that everybody picks first just cuz of their status. I have no ill harbor in my soul for them.... i was just stating an opinion. If they are happier away from here then why is it such a big deal that I am happy too. I dont think I need to apologize to anyone for stating my opinion.

Go on continue being ''happy'' Tilis. :huh:

Hi Tilis,

I guess you either don't have a job or your secretarial job is not very busy now.

Seems like you admit that there might be things wrong with the system. Reading here has done you good. We do see Powell thru his mistakes and flaws. But that doesn't mean you put a person like this in charge of other's lives.

So you admit that your pastor makes fun of people and then acts like he loves them now. I don't think your pastor would be pleased to read this.

See you kept most of your typos for the third paragraph to make your point.

I'm glad you don't have any ill fillings, because that would mean you have a bad dentist. So you are jealous of the Aloisios because they have money and you don't. Don't you know that jealousy is a sin? Shouldn't you repent so you can hear from the Holy Spirit Again? So you weren't liked in school? Weren't popular? Were you the last one picked in gym, for games? You have a lot of "ill harbor". Yes you do need to apologize when your opinion becomes slander.

You know from your pastor's teaching that jealous can make you see things wrong, see people not correctly. You know from your pastor's teaching that jealousy was the devil's sin. No, you can't be very happy. Let the jealousy go and know the peace of Jesus Christ.
.

Wait... hold the phone....

When did we get money? Did you hear that honey??? Seems like were loaded and we never knew.....Thank you TILIS.... WHOOOOOHOOOOOO!!!!!!
Gotta go.... gotta find me some money to FLAUNT;)

QUIRKY ASPARAGUS

PS. YOu obviously dont know me at all...I never got picked for ANYTHING in school;) Didnt even get picked last...i just wasnt included at all...LOL! hahahahahhah!

Tilis, you obviously have many questions about the departees & the system you are involved in. IF you don't, then why are you spending so much time on this site?
You claim that some of the people who have left ''used'' to do the same things as your pastor & thought it was ''O.K.''. The key words are ''used'' to--it's called repentence. We were each slapped in the face by the Holy Spirit revealing to each one of us these things were wrong. The system is wrong, why go on supporting it. If you choose to do so, then go on, but each person who has come to the realization about it's corruptness cannot go on with it. That's why God gives us free will & independence of thinking. God does not back corruptness. His long suffering is greater than any of us would ever be able to live under. He loves his children, even when they doing wrong. As long as that system is ''still alive'' it's because God is still holding out hope of repentence.

I have decided to play a game. This game needs 2 teams.

Since i made up the game i get to be a captain and as captain i get to choose the other one. I choose Dan (mainly cause i know he will play;)

Players
Rich
Lauren
Sierra
Hodeon
Phil
Kung
Justine
TILIS
LUCIFUGE
Mark
Greg
Bret
(and anyone else can join)

Ok i choose first
FIRST FOR TEAM QUIRKY ASPARAGUS.......TILIS
(you happy now... u were the FIRST ONE!)

K DAN YOUR PICK!;)

Let me tell you something! The love that I have received from my fans that use this site has been tremendous. Does anyone watch baseball? I did a couple of days ago and the Boston Red Sox were playin. I called some old friends in Ballimore and even up in Maine. One of them told me Babe Ruth was already traded! Imagine that. They say ya learn something new everyday but I think it only happens a few times a year. I remember TILLIS too. TILLIS used to teach the CAP kidz. For 4 weeks straight, TILLIS gave them kidz juice early and told them to gargle while tryin to correlate the fountain of wisdom in Proverbs. TILLIS was proud to declare that "some of us go to the fountain of wisdom to drink while we only gargle around here." TILLIS, don't ya know we don't teach that stuff around here...

I think TILIS has some previous issues in his/her life.

If that's not ill harbor or whatever u called it I don't know what is.....
You really must be doubting yourself and where you are in the church. Otherwise, you would be ignoring us and just getting along with your "happy" life in the church. Keep talking to us TILIS! Let it all out. Let us help you figure out the lies that surround you. :wub:

Alright, where to begin?

Tilis you have been quite the popular person on here. Congratulations! I appreciate your very humorous posts.

Believe me I am not looking for an apology? How can you apologize to me? Unless you are Tom Powell? I don't think he would post on here. I also don't think he would use really horrible grammar and spelling, the man is well educated.

Are you sure we were friends? I had very few if any in that church, and the ones I do have and hopefully continue too, were over at my house for Seahawk Sunday, other than that the people who go there are simply acquaintances.

"Manipulative". Well I don't really know what you are talking about? Can you please jog my memory, I'm sorry if I have caused you problems in your life. You can email me or call me, if we were friends then you have my email address and phone number so call. If I don't answer leave me a message.

Separate from "My Parents" they are my wifes "in laws" but that's nice that you think they are her parents, but she has two of her own.
Still I don't understand what this whole hiding behind my parents thing is? Could you elaborate some more?

I absolutely without a doubt have my reasons for leaving the church. I have not told a single person why because I am trying to be the bigger person in the situation that occurred. I have only told a few people certain things why we have left, and if you want my side and reasons for why we left call me please!!

What money?? I mean I work, I have a job, I have never talked about my personal finances with any person in my life. My wife doesn't even know how much I make sometimes. So how much do you think I make? I can't recall ever flaunting money that I don't have, sorry!

I would really like it if you would call me.
We can talk it out. If you need money maybe I can find some in my change jar to give you.


Sincerely JOE

This is Joseph Aloisio just so you don't think this is an imposter.

P.S. Could you tell me yours?

I pick Lucifuge B)

MY NEXT PICK
RICH


SO TEAM QUIRKY
Tilis
Rich

Team Dan
LUCIFUGE

WOW MY HUSBAND IS A LOT NICER THAN I AM.... GOOD THING HE IS MY "HEAD"
OR ELSE ID BE BUSTIN SOME CAPS.... (by the way not really sure what that means just always hear it in those evil movies i watch...)


QUIRKY ASPARAGUS

Justine

Lucifuge thanks Dan

TEAM DAN
Lucifuge
Justine

TEAM QUIRKY
Rich
Tilis
Channel A B C

PICK TWO NEXT

Tilis, i'll just give you these ones for starters. I appreciate the dialogue, hope it keeps up. Thanks Dan B)

Once the teams are picked i will explain the RULES AND REGULATIONS.

Kung

sorry , i pick Kung and who me

Thanks sooooo much for picking me Quirky. Hey Tilis you're on my team!!!!!!! :D

Tilis,
I do not think that you are atacking us, you are just communicating what you think, which is great and healthy. I do not take any of this personally nor should you. I also do not believe for the most part that people on this sight are attacking Tom Powell. Yes there is a lot of anger and frustration, but i have not sensed that people wish to hurt him or defame him personally. Unfortunately for him, he has made himself to be synonomous with the church. What i mean is that he doesn't think that we can critique the system and culture of the church without attacking him. Tom is just a man who was discipled by a spiritual pervert, a swindler, a sexual pervert, a very cultic leader on and on. The only problem that most people have with Tom Powell is that in light of the FACTS and EVIDENCE he will not admit it and chooses to continue to model his church after the mold of Carl Stevens and GGWO. This is a problem! Tom says that he knows nothing of the past, that Carl only fell into sin a few years ago, but everything was awesome prior to that. He's lying about that. He knows of the past because he has files in his office regarding some of the problems from decades ago, and he's been made aware of things that should make his skin crawl. yet he denies it all. Make no mistake, Tom Powell knows all that has gone on for decades in this ministry. He's been told by the people that would know, yet he supresses the truth. Carl Stevens would sacrifice any person and any thing to protect his little kingdom, and Tom Powell does the same. You only need to scan the last 90 some pages to see those he's been willing to sacrifice. Will you follow a man that will slander and lie about people that have come to these conclusions for their lives and the lives of their families?
Now even if he knows only of the problems of the last 7 years (which is not true), should he hide it from his church? Should he tell his leaders to ignore what they hear? Should he supress information? Should he decide for his people what they should believe? Is he more equipped to make these decisions for his people than they are? What if, I come to know all about what's gone on, and i find that I don't want to be associated with LGM because they still cling to the heritage of Carl Stevens and GGWO, should i be given the right to make my own decision? Does Tom Powell have the right to withhold the truth from his people? Can we actually follow a man that won't stand up for what is right just because people will leave his church? Will you follow a man that will lie and slander people that have come to these conclusions for their lives and the lives of their families?

As to how i acted in that church, like i've said before, guilty as charged. I can only ask for your forgiveness. You are right the messages haven't changed, they are still manipulative, they still teach a perversion of the body of Christ, and they still leave people with a heavy guilt and shame for what they don't do and what they are not as a person. This is validated throughout these pages. You should read them again and think of the faces that you used to know in that church.

Food for thought Tilis. You're courageous for stepping into this fire, hope to hear from you. Dan Murphy B)

Just in case you missed last night class here it is......

:D I'm getting the tape :D

Refresher Course 101

in 1981 Pastor Tom Powell founded The Bible Speaks in the Northwest (a.k.a. Greater Grace Church of Tacoma a.k.a. Living Grace Ministries a.k.a. Tacoma church). He was ordained by The Bible Speaks World Outreach whose founder and Pastor Tom Powell's self-proclaimed spiritual father was and is Carl H Stevens. (Pastor Tom Powell still refers to him as Dr Stevens although this was found out to be a fraudulent title purchased from Clarkson College which was a degree mill not a college that’s why everyone in Baltimore stopped calling him Dr Stevens Years ago)

Carl Stevens the early years… Carl proclaimed that God visited him with liquid waves of love while driving near Worthly pond on his bakery route. In his testimony he proclaimed among many things that God would anoint every message he preached. This is significant because the true believers even to this day believe that whatever is spoken by him is anointed of God. This is also significant because it is what justifies the founding cultic doctrines of Conspiracy, don’t listen / don’t talk, delegated authority, soul power relationships, God will Kill or harm you if you listen to evil reports or go against his anointed etc. etc. The bottom line is a charismatic speaker convinced some young and impressionable believers of his anointing and spiritual authority from God and that created a movement. IMO God responded to the faith of the young people, despite the corruptible behavior of Carl Stevens and ultimately the herd mentality / mob rules become the rule of thumb.

Q. What about all the miracles and amazing things that some have claimed?

A. “When the legend becomes fact, print the legend. ...”
-1962 The Man who shot Liberty Valance

Some of you went with Pastor Tom Powell to a convention a couple years ago where he had to privately correct what Carl Stevens preached. (At this time Tom Powell was fully aware of the drug and alcohol abuse the misappropriation of thousands of dollars and the vilifying and marking of anyone who tried to tell the truth and get help for the terrible problems in Baltimore) Ask yourself why speaking truth and correcting error had to be private and secretive? (A more profound question is how does God make a promise to anoint every message and yet there was clear error? Did God anoint error? Or was there never a promise?)

My guess is he knew that if he publicly denounced error he would have been marked as a trouble maker, infected, influenced by others who had an agenda, etc. As a matter of fact when he finally did leave and push a quasi reform agenda he was talked about and lied about in raps and private meetings. In sermons his behavior was alluded to but his name wasn’t mentioned.

So class why is this important? Not because in Carl's later years his problems became profound and obvious. No what is important is that all these "giants of the faith" and "men of God" (pastors both in Baltimore and around the world including Tom Powell) couldn't tell the truth for 5 - 7 years because of the delusion and deep indoctrination these men had in the cultic foundation i.e. Don't talk / don't listen, Conspiracy, Soul Power, delegated authority, God will kill, hurt or judge you if you go against his anointed etc.. Even now it is still partial truth that you are allowed to know.

This is also why many who have left are upset, why were so many treated like children who couldn't be exposed to the truth of the situation. Also why did Pastor Tom Powell treat those who left LGM the same way he and others were treated by Baltimore when he chose to leave? Why are so many so called men of God so afraid of truth and reality? This will be your homework assignment seek the answer to these questions and feel free to post.

Now that's a man i can look up to. :wacko:

Quote; Ken Blue; "Healing Spiritual Abuse"; "A more common version of the same story is the pastor who berates the church, blaming them for low attendance at services or poor support for the church programs. Rather than look at the defect in his or her own leadership, the pastor focuses attention on the flaws of the congregation. Such a person is more interested in keeping up appearances than in discovering what is actually wrong. There is one variety of abusive leader who is so preoccupied with keeping up appearances as to utterly deny human weakness and the depth of human fallenness....Often this pastor has gathered a leadership core of "yes men and women" who never confront problems. Since the pastor is allowed to live in denial, no one else is allowed human weakness either. Such denial suffocates honesty and fosters abuse."

No posters want to discuss the Babe Ruth trade?

What is this world coming too.

:)