Source

I can actually start to see all that "Blu-Ray isnt needed" talk vanishing.
If anyone isnt a member of the site above, register. Its worth reading what they've got to say.

Well reading that, the main problem that's bugging them is that 360 doesn't have a gauranteed harddrive.
Well there's a simple conclusion for that: Stick a "Harddrive required" sticker on the 360 version of the game...Screw all the people who are screwing us by buying the cheap version of the 360, besides, it won't be that hard to get a harddrive.

It's a simple decision enough, but as one of your quotes say, Rockstar are just greedy for cash, and would rather tone down a game that lose some potential customers. Well if they want to make a smart decision, then make the game require a hard drive to play.


And what's with these random guys you're always quoting off that website? You worship them or something?



Oh, and take note of how they never say 360's hardware itself is the limitation. 360 is well enough able to handle the game in terms of graphics and gameplay, but it's the low-spec console (Core Pack) that's annoying them, because of it's lack of hard drive. Well not alot of people bought the Core Pack anyway, and I hope Rockstar will make the decent decision...

Do that and you half the amount of xbox owners buying the game.

Your walking over the line of being personal. Do that again and i'll gun the shit outta you.
Those people i quoted, are people who actually know something about the consoles. That actually own the consoles and arnt fanboys like you and i.

So if anyone's word is more legible. Its theres.

If you got your ass out of the "HALO LOVERZ HAXORZ SITEZ" and went on some good ones, maybe you'd learn some things.

Oh yeah, notice how everyone says that the xbox version will be a toned down version. So basically, what i said before was right.

Have fun playing GTAIV with shit graphics, NO Cheatdevice and On 2 discs. Swapping every time you go to a part of LC.

^_^

Lol, not alot of people bought the Core, it didn't sell very well compared to the Premium, so your theory is out of the window there.

And I'm sorry, but whoever they are or however much they spend their lives on the internet, they're just reading it wrong.
They DID NOT say the 360 version is going to be toned down, not did they say the 360 can't handle the game.
How about you stop following everything these random people say and think for yourself? They said that it's the HARD DRIVE that's the problem - NOT the console. Do I have to be it in BOLD for you?

Therefore, the 360 version WILL NOT have "shit" graphics. Oh, and didn't you know that whole trailer was running off the 360 version? And the GTA4 that the game magazines tested were the 360 version, even the OPM magazine actually played the 360 version.
So if you're calling the 360 version "shit graphics", then you're calling that eye-popping trailer shit. Not to mention the magazines even said that the GTAVI they played had been improved from the trailer, so it's only getting better and better.
And for the LAST TIME, even Rockstsar have said that THE TWO VERSIONS WILL BE ALMOST IDENTICAL TO EACHOTHER. And just in case you forgot in all the hassle of kissing the feet of those random people, Rockstar are MAKING GTA4 :o

As for CD, well it isn't gauranteed the PS3 version will have CD anyway, and it IS possible for the 360. And all the GTAs we owned on our PS2s (the best ones might I add), we all enjoyed WITHOUT CheatDevice, more than the GTA PSPs, even with the CD. We all survived perfectly without CD for AGES and enjoyed the hell out of the game. If you're saying GTA's are shit without CD (well the GTA PSPs are), then you don't deserve to own GTAIV.
Who actually needs CD in GTA anyway? We've all been playing games for all these years, and had many great times with friends and online with others WITHOUT CD, and what does CD give you? A few cool things to do on your own? A short little thrill?
Ha, CD is far from compulsory in games today.
I'm not saying EC's work is shit, it's great, but my point is that we can live without CD...

As for two discs...HA, keep dreaming.

What are you exactly trying to prove? The 360 is the shitiest console in the entire world and you turn into 'Ps3 Orgasm' mode?

I don't even care about what a bunch of people say, All I know is I've got my 360 and I am extremely satisfied with it. To be honest, I don't care what the Ps3's specs are compared to the 360's, or if GTAIV will run better on whichever console.

Lets just wait and find out which one rocks and which one has slightly tilted gameplay.

No, GTAIV will not suck on either console. Nuff said.

Idiots these days.

Did you not see where they mentioned that the dvd is holding them back?

Think about it like this, if this game is going to set the standard of "Next Gen HD Gaming" how the hell is it going to do it on dvd?!

All i see is ps3 owners, who have spent there hard earned cash to get the best of next gen, getting a compromised game.

Can we come to the agreement, that if this game was built just for ps3, it would be 100 times better? Everyone knows it would be.

As one of those guys said:

You cant tell me thats not true. It is. So what are they going to carry on doing?! Crapping ps3 games down so that the xbox can handle them too?!

Argh, watch how Assassins Creed is going to be shit be cause it has to be dumbed down for the xbox.

I'm not a hater. 360 has some amazing games like Lost Planet and Test Drive unlimited. But it wont last any longer then Summer 08. That i'm sure of.

I don't see anything where they say the DVD is holding them back...And all the amazing games I've seen seem to have no trouble fitting it onto a disc. It's just GTAIV so far, cos of all the content put into it, no other game has as much content as GTA games, so I'm sure if this issue ever comes up again, it'll only be in GTA games.

And soon they'll have to make it require a hard drive to play the game, there's no other way.

And saying it would be "100 times better" is very poor logic there...

If they have to, they must make it require a hard drive to play, and after that there'll be no problems with fitting games onto it.

And the game's aren't dumbed down. Dumbing them down is when the console can't handle the game, and the 360 is well enough capable of handling any game. It's the memory that's the problem, not the console's hardware itself. No games will be dumbed down.

You'll see in October how identical the games are, and I'll be enjoying my exclusive content while you're desperately trying to look for differences.

Lets take this step by step.
1. Can we agree that the playstation 3 is alot more powerful then the 360?
2. Lots of things that developers want to put on games that are cross platform, just cant be handled by the xbox.
3. So you think, xbox will be churning out as good a games as ps3 in a years time?

The way this is going, dont expect to have gta on xbox. If GTAIV is already pushing the limits of the 360, then what the hell is the next gta going to be doing?! Killing the dvd drives?!
GTAIV is already going to be huge, so the next one will be even bigger. You cant tell me you think they'll fit that onto a dvd aswell, can you?
They may aswell put a sticker on the front saying "ONLY FOR OWNERS OF HD-DVD DRIVE" on the 360 version.

Blu ray is the future of next gen gaming. Cell Broadband Engine is the future of Nextgen Gaming. PS3 is the future of next gen gaming.

Why is that so hard for you to understand?!

Hahaha. No it cant. Games are already being dumbed down. Imagine what compromises the Assassins creed team had to make to allow an a 360 version to be the same as the ps3 one?!
Its stupid 360 owners that are compromising PS3 games.

Dude, you're getting way too off-track with this.

Take some time to read Rockstar's message again. They didn't say the 360 can't handle the game hardware wise, it's the fact about the lack of HARD DRIVE. Get that into your head!
You saw that trailer, it was amazing, and if the 360 couldn't handle the game, then we couldn't get that amazing draw distance, no loading times or no pop-ups.

And the PS3 isn't as more powerful as you first think.
I agree the PS3 is more powerful, but not so powerful that it's worth paying another £200. Even Rockstar said that the two versions will be identical to eachother, so you're just plain bullshitting about this crap.

There's not been any game so far that the 360 has difficulty handling, so stop kidding yourself about this "360 can't handle GTAIV" crap, cos it clearly can. I don't understand why you don't even believe what Rockstar are saying about the game.
Remember they're the ones making the game, and developing for both consoles? Not you. They know alot more and better than both of us, and you probably won't believe this either, but they even know better than those "gods" over at that site! :o

Seriously, stop following, and think for yourself. That way you won't be so blinded.

Yes it is. See, the xbox will die by 08, where as the ps3 will still be triumphing in 2910 maybe even 2011 if we're to follow the ps2.

You keep saying this, the comprimised version of GTAIV works well on the xbox. They will be indentical, but one with alot more force pushing it.
Its like playing a SA on the best pc atm, against the a pc bought in 2000. The game is identical, it will just have alot more power behiend it. Meaning everything will run better, look better.

Oblivion.

If we were to ask R* now: "Is GTAIV being compromised so that it can run on 360? Are some of the things you want to achieve, not achievable with the 360?"

What do you think the answer to that will be?

And stop saying shit about other people on other sites. Your just begging for this to change from an informative argument to a flamewar. You dont want to go there.

Vii, I personally hate you. But anyway, I'm going to post the specs of both machines. I'm not a fanboy of either console, but I just hate Nintendo. Childish games.. ugh. And I just prefer the 360 rather than the Ps3, just because it has better games out for it at the moment.

360 specs:

A 20GB hard drive, high-def game support and a 500MHz ATI graphics processor: Glimpse the Xbox 360's system performance specifications as provided by Microsoft.

Custom IBM PowerPC-based CPU
• Three symmetrical cores running at 3.2 GHz each
• Two hardware threads per core; six hardware threads total
• VMX-128 vector unit per core; three total
• 128 VMX-128 registers per hardware thread
• 1 MB L2 cache

CPU Game Math Performance
• 9 billion dot product operations per second

Custom ATI Graphics Processor
• 500MHz processor
• 10 MB of embedded DRAM
• 48-way parallel floating-point dynamically scheduled shader pipelines
• Unified shader architecture

Polygon Performance
• 500 million triangles per second

Pixel Fill Rate
• 16 gigasamples per second fill rate using 4x MSAA

Shader Performance
• 48 billion shader operations per second

Memory
• 512 MB of GDDR3 RAM
• 700 MHz of DDR
• Unified memory architecture

Memory Bandwidth • 22.4 GB/s memory interface bus bandwidth
• 256 GB/s memory bandwidth to EDRAM
• 21.6 GB/s front-side bus

Overall System Floating-Point Performance
• 1 teraflop

Storage
• Detachable and upgradeable 20GB hard drive
• 12x dual-layer DVD-ROM
• Memory Unit support starting at 64 MB

I/O
• Support for up to four wireless game controllers
• Three USB 2.0 ports
• Two memory unit slots

Optimized for Online
• Instant, out-of-the-box access to Xbox Live features with broadband service, including Xbox Live Marketplace for downloadable content, gamer profile for digital identity, and voice chat to talk to friends while playing games, watching movies or listening to music
• Built-in Ethernet port
• Wi-Fi ready: 802.11a, 802.11b and 802.11g
• Video camera ready

Digital Media Support
• Support for DVD-Video, DVD-ROM, DVD-R/RW, DVD+R/RW, CD-DA, CD-ROM, CD-R, CD-RW, WMA CD, MP3 CD, JPEG Photo CD
• Ability to stream media from portable music devices, digital cameras and Windows XP-based PCs
• Ability to rip music to the Xbox 360 hard drive • Custom playlists in every game
• Built-in Media Center Extender for Windows XP Media Center Edition 2005
• Interactive, full-screen 3-D visualizers

High-Definition Game Support
• All games supported at 16:9, 720p and 1080i, anti-aliasing
• Standard-definition and high-definition video output supported

Audio
• Multichannel surround sound output
• Supports 48KHz 16-bit audio
• 320 independent decompression channels
• 32-bit audio processing
• Over 256 audio channels

System Orientation
• Stands vertically or horizontally

Customizable Face Plates
• Interchangeable to personalize the console

Tis impressive, better than the Wii, And Wii is not Next-gen, did any of you know that?

Ps3's specs:

CPU: Cell Processor

* PowerPC-base Core @3.2GHz
* 1 VMX vector unit per core
* 512KB L2 cache
* 7 x SPE @3.2GHz
* 7 x 128b 128 SIMD GPRs
* 7 x 256KB SRAM for SPE
* * 1 of 8 SPEs reserved for redundancy total floating point performance: 218 GFLOPS

GPU: RSX @550MHz

* 1.8 TFLOPS floating point performance
* Full HD (up to 1080p) x 2 channels
* Multi-way programmable parallel floating point shader pipelines

Sound: Dolby 5.1ch, DTS, LPCM, etc. (Cell-base processing)

Memory:

* 256MB XDR Main RAM @3.2GHz
* 256MB GDDR3 VRAM @700MHz

System Bandwidth:

* Main RAM: 25.6GB/s
* VRAM: 22.4GB/s
* RSX: 20GB/s (write) + 15GB/s (read)
* SB: 2.5GB/s (write) + 2.5GB/s (read)

System Floating Point Performance: 2 TFLOPS

Storage:

* HDD
* Detachable 2.5” HDD slot x 1

I/O:

* USB: Front x 4, Rear x 2 (USB2.0)
* Memory Stick: standard/Duo, PRO x 1
* SD: standard/mini x 1
* CompactFlash: (Type I, II) x 1

Communication: Ethernet (10BASE-T, 100BASE-TX, 1000BASE-T) x3 (input x 1 + output x 2)

Wi-Fi: IEEE 802.11 b/g

Bluetooth: Bluetooth 2.0 (EDR)

Controller:

* Bluetooth (up to 7)
* USB2.0 (wired)
* Wi-Fi (PSP®)
* Network (over IP)

AV Output:

* Screen size: 480i, 480p, 720p, 1080i, 1080p
* HDMI: HDMI out x 2
* Analog: AV MULTI OUT x 1
* Digital audio: DIGITAL OUT (OPTICAL) x 1

CD Disc media (read only):

* PlayStation CD-ROM
* PlayStation 2 CD-ROM
* CD-DA (ROM), CD-R, CD-RW
* SACD Hybrid (CD layer), SACD HD
* DualDisc (audio side), DualDisc (DVD side)

DVD Disc media (read only):

* PlayStation 2 DVD-ROM
* PLAYSTATION 3 DVD-ROM
* DVD-Video: DVD-ROM, DVD-R, DVD-RW, DVD+R, DVD+RW

Blu-ray Disc media (read only):

* PLAYSTATION 3 BD-ROM
* BD-Video: BD-ROM, BD-R, BD-RE

Due to a much complicated website I got that from, its a bit harder to understand.

I just felt the need to post the specs, and, if you look there isn't an extremely mass difference.

Oh, very scientific predictions you got there... <_<

As for that "more force pushing it" business, that we settled that your theory was wrong in the other topic about which version will be better. I can't be bothered to bring it up again, so look it up in the topic yourself.

I dunno what they're doing now, but you still haven't given me evidence where they said it's the 360's power that's bringing them down. From what I'm read, the only problem is the lack of harddrive, and as I said earlier: Screw the people who bought Core.

Only problem with that is, because R* has said that Gta IV will be for 360, they cannot suddenly omit the core owners as that will have serious repercussions for them, what with the backlash the core owners will give them, bad publicity etc. Plus the market base they will loose.
If they had said from the start that IV would need users to have a HDD then it wouldn’t have been such a problem.

Well it isn't all over for them though, they can still just buy a HDD from the shops to play the game. And sure some may say "omg buying a HDD just for one game is stupid", but it helps with all games and future use for the 360.
With the release of the Elite, I think Micrsoft should stop making Core Systems. They simply aren't selling that well, and it's starting to cause problems with developers with it's lack of hard drive.

That, or they could include a HDD with each Core Pack in the market, and not increase the price (or not by alot, maybe like £5-£10). And the people who bought the Core Pack before free HDD offer can recieve one for free from Microsoft. They fix 360's for free (even when it's out of warranty), so I'm sure they can give out free HDDs for those few Core owners out there, especially when it will keep them safe with games for this generation.

This is why GTA games should remain a god damn Playstation exclusive.
So much bluddy hassle, now rockstar need to start thinking of ideas instead of making the game as good as possible.

I hope for fuck sake that the next gta doesnt go multiplatform. I hope this nasty encounter will knock some sense into R* and Take2.

calm down its only a game

You know, something similar happened last time.
Remember San Andreas? The Xbox version could have been alot better, but it was dumbed down for the PS2. Remember that?
None of us complained did we?

And this time, it's not even about dumbing down, but it's just MEMORY, and you're already quick to complain and moan.
And as emcp said, just chill out and face the facts that developer's #1 priority is cash, and they don't comprimise anything else if it loses them more cash.

You really make me laugh some times..:P

Umm..NO.
The Xbox version wasnt even planned. The game was made just for the ps2. But after seeing what a great success it was, they ported it.

Get your facts right.

You know, something similar has just happened.

Remember Saints row? Thats being released for ps3 in about a months time. It took everyone by suprise. Was the game developed for the xbox and ps3? No. Just for the xbox, but now its getting ported.

No ones moaning because we're getting a game that we wernt expecting to play unless we had a 360.

Same rule applies.

Uhh...sorry I didn't exactly understand your point...

And how does this link to the topic?

So, just so we can get this done and dusted, this is what 1up's "Everything we know about GTAIV" article says about the issue:

I find it funny and weird how out of all the magazines that tested the game, it's only the Official Playstation Magazine that seems to be claiming this. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying they're lieing or anything, but they could be taking it a little out of context...

Lets be honest, every official magazine (official xbox, official playstation, official nintendo) are all biased in favour of their console in some way. I mean you wouldn't exactly see Official Xbox saying "PS3 is more powerfull than 360 and has blu-ray, so 360 sucks" or Official Playstation magazine saying "360 is cheaper and has better games, so PS3 sucks" would you?
Better they make people in favour of their console the more copies of their magazine they sell...need I say more?

So therefore, they could be taking it a bit out of context, and perhaps making a big deal out of something minor that can be fixed anyway.

And yes, Rockstar did make the announcement themselves (I think), but that was to clear up what OPM was saying.


So anyway, watch how 1up say "the Core system" and its lack of harddrive. Yes he does say it causes a few issues with load times and cache, but as they said, there's no reason to why they won't have solved the issue before release, without dumbing it down of course. And even if somehow they don't, it'l only be for the Core system, not the Premium system which all real gamers who care about this stuff have.

Ok, so NOW can we lay this to rest? Or atleast wait we get more information/the release?

so true XBOX is holding us back I got my ps3 the other day I think I made a wise decission buying it.. there keeping us in the dust because the 360 won't comply it seams! Look's like sony win's again with Power :D

No, That isn't the problem. The console itself can run the game easily, its just a problem of memory with the disc. Can nobody get that? MEMORY...K?

The 360 isn't as powerfull as the Ps3, But it's not that far off from it. And the 360.. Well.. In my opinion has better (Not to mention more) games for it.

No, seriously, I'll spark you if you say something stupid like that again...

This topic was finally going to be layed to rest, and you come in talking about shit that's already been argued about with like 5 essays...Read before you post and you'll see that you have no idea what you're chatting about.

@JB: Don't bother trying to persuade him, if reading the whole topic won't make him be quiet, then nothing will. Just let him go around talking shit, all will be cleared when the game launches.

I'd love to see you try.
I hate when you say shit like that. Trying to act hard.
Remember, my school is a bus journey away from yours. I know your full name and school name. I wont hesitate to come down and play shank games with Praveen.

Shank games? LOL, I'm just trying to get a point across, no need for you to get involved and create an arguement.
Now let this topic die ffs...